syncronization and frequency lock via genlock

Christie Pandoras Box Version 5

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Re: syncronization and frequency lock via genlock

Postby JustynR » Tue Mar 22, 2016 3:39 pm

Sorry, I misread.

You just said to test with the Imagepro
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Re: syncronization and frequency lock via genlock

Postby plbrunet » Tue Mar 22, 2016 3:43 pm

Hi Daniel,

Our GTX970 with 2 outputs are setup like this:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B4VkNuY3RAt3RHdTRE1IeDlqWnc/view?usp=sharing
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B4VkNuY3RAt3YTRHLVZBOTdUNHc/view?usp=sharing

I haven't seen options for "spanning view" and such in many many years. I didn't think they still existed.
With this card we have no control in terms of how the displays are setup other than Clone or Not Clone.
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Re: syncronization and frequency lock via genlock

Postby plbrunet » Tue Mar 22, 2016 3:46 pm

It didn't seem like it was just luck that the 2 outputs from 1 GTX970 were in sync because every time we ran that test, it was always in sync. And with the video files of the lines and the frames, it is really apparent when we are not in sync.
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Re: syncronization and frequency lock via genlock

Postby schoissi » Wed Mar 23, 2016 2:37 am

@ Pierre:
do the led wall controller have a genlock option?
i think to be sure it only makes sense if you genlock the whole system,
Pandora and led wall controller.

in general,
there is currently a discussion on FB in the christie video processors group about genlock on the x20,
might be interesting to read.

all the best,
Roman
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Re: syncronization and frequency lock via genlock

Postby plbrunet » Wed Mar 23, 2016 6:07 am

Hi Roman,

That would be ideal but our processors and most of them do not have genlock options. That being said, so far our processors have not caused any issues. We are able to have scenarios where both processors are in sync. That depends of what we put in front of them.

Speaking of:

Daniel, we made 2 other tests today. I did not have a DVI DA handy but I used the Loop out of the LED processor 1 to go in the 2nd LED processor.
1 computer -> 1 output -> into 1 LED processor -> Loop out to 2nd LED processor -> To 2 LED screens.
Version 1 is with our line and frame # video file
Version 2 is with a flashing white image playing in a video file. (see link below)
https://drive.google.com/folderview?id=0B4VkNuY3RAt3RHFSSG9IU2V0dFE&usp=sharing

Everything was in sync which confirms that our LED processors do not affect the signal or its vertical sync.
We made several tests where it was obvious that things were no longer in sync. For example, when we make the signal go through a Crestron DM-MD 128x128 matrix we loose our sync. We are currently in discussion with them to see if this can be corrected. As soon as we bypass the matrix, we can be in sync again.

So to come back to our main question, when we have 2 computers (each with 1 output from a Quadro M4000 and a Quadro Sync card which are synced (Frame locked) to one another (master - client)) and FluidFrame at OFF we do not get a synced signal. The Nvidia manual suggest that we put vertical sync ON when we Frame Lock quadro cards. We tried with 2 scenarios (Vertical sync ON and Vertical sync = Let 3D application decide) and in both cases we were not in sync.

Does that mean that Quadros and Quadro sync cards are not doing their job? Is there an incompatibility with Coolux? Is there a setting in the graphics cards that we need to change? Is FluidFrame Necessary for sync to take place? To me it seems that it should not be necessary when using Frame Locked video cards.

What do you think?
If you'd like to have our video test files, I'm happy to send them to you. Note that they are in 30 fps since we are in 60hz. We could probably make a 25fps version if needed.

Thanks.
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Re: syncronization and frequency lock via genlock

Postby plbrunet » Wed Mar 30, 2016 6:38 am

Hello again guys,

Do we have any news on this?

Thanks.
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Re: syncronization and frequency lock via genlock

Postby Daniel Kaminski » Thu Mar 31, 2016 4:40 pm

Hi Luc,

very hard to tell from here if your nvidia sync cards are working correctly or not.
They should work correctly and do in our Office. Currently we are only selling servers with K5000 and Sync Board. We do not seel M4000.
Maybe try a different driver version. We have had problems before that were driver related.
Also how do you test if the Sync Board works? Best way is a highspeed camera and RGB Frames at the same Frequency as Output / EDID.

Here are a few recommendations:
For LED Walls we always recommend to get all LED processors out of a single GPU. Best a Quadro GPU in Mosaik Mode. Here you should never ever have a problem.

If that is not possible:
Genlock the GPUs using a Sync Board and also use Fluidframe.


Daniel
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Re: syncronization and frequency lock via genlock

Postby JustynR » Wed Apr 06, 2016 1:20 am

I just ran into the same problem...

But I have a really weird workaround...

Remove the offending site from the show, then re-add it and everything is in sync!


Can't explain why, but it works.

I'm submitting a report to Coolux support right now.

But my workaround for this show that I have going on is to copy and paste all of the containers on all of the timelines to a dummy machine, then pasting it to the one that I drag back in.
It really sucks, but it works...
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Re: syncronization and frequency lock via genlock

Postby plbrunet » Wed Apr 06, 2016 4:57 am

Very strange Justyn, I may be able to try it a bit later on. But we're not the only ones having issues.

Daniel, with our setup of the M4000 everything looks as though the sync setup is correct. I've read through the Nvidia sync documents to follow the procedure and the Nvidia configuration panels show that one computers is the master clock and that another computer is following the clock as a client. The LEDs at the back of the video cards are also showing up correctly as though everything is in sync.

The Nvidia guide says to enable vertical sync. We have try with it ON and "Use 3D application settings" and it didn't change anything.
http://www.nvidia.com/docs/IO/127059/quadro-sync-user-guide.pdf
Is there anything else we need to check to make sure we are setup correctly?
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Re: syncronization and frequency lock via genlock

Postby erica frost » Thu May 05, 2016 3:47 pm

Just jumping in on this thread with a question about the necessity to use fluid frame when playing content over multiple outputs over multiple servers.

I am currently running a show with a bit of a special setup. We are using three rev3 SSD Server Pros that have K5000 graphics cards and sync boards.
- All servers are frame-locked. The first server is the master and the other two are daisy chained as clients.
- All 6 outputs of the servers are connected directly via display port into a Barco E2.
- The E2 is then splitting this 6 input canvas into 7 separate 1440x1050 outputs
- This is feeding 7 projectors which are outputting to 7 edge-butted screens creating a large seven sided semi-cirlce screen.

As there is no edge-blending at all to create this final 9800x1050 output, and in fact the outputs of all three servers are being edge-butted within E2, it is critical that all the outputs stay in sync. Trust me when I say that any sync issues out of the servers on the projection at this scale is glaringly obvious and impossible to hide from the client!!

For reasons that I don't want to take too much time explaining why now, all of the content is being created as one large 10003x1080 image stack which is then split to be played back over the three servers. Each server is playing back at least one 3840x1080 PNG image sequence. Occasionally they are being pushed to playback 2 files of 3840x1080 PNG image sequences for transitions with a 1920x1080 VT pipped over the top.

With the correct amount of pre-roll and attention being paid to loading and unloading of files in the programming, I can happily report that I am on day 9 of a 10 day conference without output sync issues (not sure if I've just pushed my luck saying that before the conference is over!)

I bring this up in this thread because none of the files being used have FluidFrame enabled.
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Re: syncronization and frequency lock via genlock

Postby JustynR » Fri May 06, 2016 4:43 am

Now you've done it!
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Re: syncronization and frequency lock via genlock

Postby erica frost » Mon May 09, 2016 1:14 pm

Job done and dusted. Happy to report that everything worked great for all the shows :D
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